Conference turris::womannotes-v2

    D!, in this Version of -WN-, I started  Basenote 251, entitled
    "Dressing For Sex-Cess", which I believe relates to some of the 
    questions you've asked.
    
    Also, in V1, there's a Note "To Have A Few Eyes On Us", that may
    provide further insight. 
    
    Our resident historian, Jody, will have to give you the Note number
    for that one though.
    
      Alan
                       

    
    See also
    
    Womannotes_v1
    637 - to have a few eyes on us
    
    Human_Relations
    450 - to have a few eyes on us
    
    womannotes_v2
    251 - dressing for sex-cess
    556 - when is sexy OK?
    
    euro_woman
    26 - sexy clothes - why
    
    
    -Jody
    

    
    I don't think women who dress sexily at work are taken as seriously as
    those who don't, and they probably aren't listened to as well or as
    credibly as those who don't.  Unless they don't have upwardly-mobile 
    ambitions, I think dressing that way can be a career limiting move and
    can create a credibility gap.  
    
    -Jody

    G'Day,
    
    	I find that the way the women dress around here is more like a
    competition between themselves to see who can make themselves look
    better.  Whether they are actually trying to attract or influence
    someone is anybodies guess.  I've noticed that if only one or two women
    work in a department then generally neither will dress sexily (is that
    a word?), but if there is upwards of say five then out come the good
    clothes and let the parade begin.  In this building there is a group of
    about 10 women working with 5 men.  When this group first started here
    they dressed in what is probably accepted as 'normal' office attire. 
    Then one started to spice it up a little until we are now at the point
    where you never see them wearing the same thing twice (although we sure
    would like to see of them twice :-) ).
    
    	I don't know how (if) they deal with the attention that they
    receive from the males.  After all this really gets back to the old
    'they're asking for it' scenario.  It's hard to say this without
    sounding terrible but before the change in fashion most of the men
    probably would not have looked twice at a couple of the women involved
    but now they ALL command admiring glances every day.
    
    	We're approaching winter now so the outfits will become a little
    less risque.  All I can say is roll on summer :-).
    
    David.
    

    I don't understand what the problem is. Im probably one of those people
    you see, with an occasional short skirt & high heels.  I think that 
    people dress in the fashion that makes them feel good about themselves.
    When I know I have a meeting or an interview I dress more
    'professionally', but on those days when I have alot of deskwork or I
    know my time is pretty much my own I dress comfortably.  Ive never had
    any man approach me in an offhand manner, and Ive never had to put up
    with any kind of harrassment.  I also don't feel that I have a problem
    with being taken seriously at work - I guess I have a strong enough 
    personality that prevents that from happening.  I dress according to
    the way I feel that morning, and in accordance to my work schedule, and
    I find myself just as happy in a denim skirt than in a business suit.
    I don't think it has anything to do with dressing 'sexily', or dressing
    to attract attention - I think its merely a matter of being comfortable
    enough with yourself to dress in whatever way makes you feel good on
    that particular day.
    
    Maureen

    
    Well, I agree with David that the "competition" is often between women
    to see who can dress the best.  It also often depends on the type of
    women and unfortunately on the availability and "attractiveness" of the
    men around.  Please note, this is my own opinion based on MY
    experiences.  In our department there are 3 women and 1 male, very
    married, older man.  Not one of us is the sort to dress to impress or
    compete with each other though we may dress "more well" on particular
    occasions.  This occasions can range from dressing smartly for an
    important meeting or dressing to go out after work.  It depends on the
    situtation.  I myself may dress particularly well on some occasions to
    make me feel good, this however does not include skimpy tight clothing,
    more tailored and smart.  If I feel good I look good.
    	In regards to short, tight clothing for work........My first
    thought is "how can they, it must be so incomfortable!".  Secondly,
    yes, it may be sexist but I think it inappropriate.  But who am I to
    judge, that is just the way some individuals are.  I wouldn't do it
    myself but that's not to say it's "wrong".  There is no doubt it does
    attract attention and not (IMO) of the favourable sort.  I have fairly
    close social and work contacts with a number of younger guys in this
    building.  There are a number of girls who they discuss in the context
    of "oh, wouldn't you just like to....".  I don't like it but I don't
    blame them for it.  There are some girls who seem to go out of their
    way to attract attention like that (by actions as well as clothes).  
    I could rabbit on for hours about this.  I will stop here but I would 
    just like to say I don't know how they do it.  Maybe these sort of people 
    are to be admired, they are not afraid to stand out, but I don't like to 
    be "ogled" in a work situation and would not like to be talked about the 
    way I know some people (including me) talk.  
    
    
    	Holly

          re: .6 (Holly Wright)
          
          > In regards to short, tight clothing for work........
          > My first thought is "how can they, it must be so
          > incomfortable!".  Secondly, yes, it may be sexist but I think
          > it inappropriate.
          
          That is my first thought as well, too!
          
          When the woman wearing the tight, short clothing (often with
          heels) is obviously not comfortable, it makes me really wonder
          "why".    In contrast, the men whom I judge to be dressed "sexy"
          always appear as though they could be nothing but comfortable in
          their sexy attire.
          
          But, now that I think about it, men's clothing that is (IMO) sexy
          would also seem to be very comfortable.  That is definitely not
          the case for women's clothing that is traditionally deemed sexy.
          
                                                            nancy b.

    
    Comfortable and uncomfortable (perhaps sexy) clothes.....
    
    A little of the track but if you think about it... for a woman to dress
    "sexily" she has to i) wear stockings (they can get soooo uncomfortable
    sometimes, mine always edge their way down my legs).
    			ii) wear an uplifting bra (ouch, those wires)
    			iii) tight short skirt (rides up with wear and very
    difficult to eat or drink in).
    			iv) revealing or body hugging top (makes normal
    manouvering difficult)
    			v) high heels (sore feet and funny walk)
    
    A man wears 	i) shirt
    			ii) trousers
    
    NOT FAIR! :-)
    
    Now admittedly sexy varies from person to person but when talking about
    brief, sexy clothes at work this is what springs to my mind for woman. 
    I prefer comfortable, soft, fitted but not tight clothes.  If I wore
    something like that to work I probably end up going home to change.  
    Going out is different, everyone enjoys dressing up.  But to do it
    every day would take the fun out of it for me.  I have desire to spend
    all of my life looking sexy and being uncomfortable.  Besides if you
    are uncomfortable it usually shows and makes it worse and more
    noticeable!!
    
    
    		Holly

	A few years ago on Halloween I wore a short (very short) dress
	and stockings and the works.  Any way.  It was an outfit that
	I wore back in 1967 and was comfortable then in it (somehow??)
	but that day at work was torture I could not sit comfortably
	I could not carry anything I could not fix problems.  All I 
	could do was STAND around and look nice. YUCK.  That is something
	I hate to do (mostly cause it is sooooo hard not to jump in
	and fix something that is broke).

	On the other hand maybe today I am more aware of how other's
	judge by the manner of dress that is worn.

	_peggy