| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 517.1 | | NEBVAX::PAPPALARDO | I'm the NRA | Thu Oct 19 1989 14:27 | 7 |
|
I use #6, 12ga 2 3/4 inch with 1 1/4qtr shot its always worked
good for me for both woodcock and partridge.
Rick
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| 517.2 | shot | FSHQA2::DALAKOSKI | | Thu Oct 19 1989 15:58 | 15 |
| Early I use #8, #9 if the old reloader is filled with that.
The critical issue here I believe is the quality of the shot. Use
the same extra hard shot we'd use for serious trap and skeet
competition. In fact, the major difference in terms of performance
between expensive, store-bought shells and junk is shot quality.
The penetration of good hard shot is the difference between clean
kills even on the edge of the pattern and crips that even a good
dog can't find.
On size, move to 71/2's later.
On amount, well, more is better.
I haven't had a chance to get out. How are woodcock and patridge
in Mass and S. N.H. this year?
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| 517.3 | | WAHOO::LEVESQUE | The trigger doesn't pull the finger | Thu Oct 19 1989 16:51 | 5 |
| Why go to larger pellets later in the season? Intuitively, it would seem
that you'd want to do the opposite, since the leaves will be down later in
the season. Puzzled.
The Doctah
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| 517.4 | go with manufactures reccomendations | CUERVO::GATH | | Thu Oct 19 1989 17:21 | 30 |
| It is usually the general rule because as the season goes along
the shots usually get longer.
Smaller shot size loses its energy faster and at longer distances
it penitrating value is decreased all along some of the plumage
might be getting heavier ( I'm not sure of this ) which also would
decrease effectiveness.
If you are still getting close shots small pellets can still be
effective.
I do not advocate the use of small shot. I beleive that the
use of extra hard shot does kill better. On the other hand
I do not advocate the use of large shot either.
I find that my favorites are in line with what is printed in most
books and what is on the back of some shells or where ever the
manufactures print it
I use # 71/2 for partridge ( ruffed Grouse )
woodcock ( purhaps a little large for this bird )
Rabbits
Pheasants
I use to use # 5 for ducks
and 4's and 2's for geese
Now I use steel #2's 1's and BB
Bear
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| 517.5 | New Shot Questions | CRISTA::DUKELOW | Totally Tubular | Fri Oct 20 1989 11:23 | 7 |
| I have a simular question along these lines. What is the actual size of
"T" shot in relation to say, BB's.(I know that it's bigger) Is it a
good choice over 2's or BB's for geese. Another question is what is the
purpose of these multi-size shot shells(T-BB-2)? Are they designed for
a specific application(ie. close shooting) or is it multi purpose? Has
anyone had any experience with this stuff. I'd like to hear from anyone
who has and your opinion on it's effectiveness.
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| 517.6 | | WAHOO::LEVESQUE | The trigger doesn't pull the finger | Fri Oct 20 1989 12:16 | 5 |
| The theory behind the multi-size shells is that you get the large pellets
to put the bird down, and the smaller pellets to help fill out the pattern.
Don't know how well it works.
The Doctah
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| 517.7 | ex | FRAGLE::JOLLYMORE | I'm the NRA | Fri Oct 20 1989 15:00 | 8 |
| The steel shot sizes are 4, 3, 2, 1, BB, BBB, T, and I belive
there is another above T but not shure.
In Mass. the largest you can use is BBB this year last year it was
BB they whent up one size. Check your state regs for the largest
size allowed in your state.
Bill
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| 517.8 | etc... | BTOVT::REMILLARD_K | | Fri Oct 20 1989 15:53 | 32 |
|
re .5
I have to dig up my steel shot chart to answer your question, I was
wondering the actual size of T myself.
For steel I think the only choices for geese are BBB and T, where BBB
would equal 2's and T would equal BB in mass of lead. If your thinking
about 2's (steel) for geese I think your way under loaded, that is
similar to #4 in lead, which by my book is too small. I can vouch for
T it really works. So Mass. has outlawed T? what a crying shame, this
should be fought hard by you guys, what is the shot size limitations
for lead? (or what did they use to be)? In VT we can go up to T, but
they canned F on us...
Never heard of a tri-plex load, but the duplex loads (BBX2) are common.
The advantage is a longer shot string, with the smaller pellets out
front at close ranges, and the larger pellets out front (with energy)
at farther ranges. From what I've been reading they really kick butt.
STEEL
personally - BBB and T for geese
-3's and 2's for duck
LEAD
-7 1/2 's for grouse, 1 3/8 oz...all season
-all my other left over lead for skeet....or decoy weights...
Kevin
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| 517.9 | Why such big shot for geese? | CLUSTA::STORM | | Fri Oct 20 1989 17:32 | 8 |
| RE:.8 I don't understand why you think you need "buckshot" size shot
for geese. What distance are you taking those shots? I've dropped
several geese with 12 gauge 3" steel #2s at 40 yards or so. My
prefered load now is #1 steel shot and I'm not haveing much crippling
(none so far).
Mark,
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| 517.10 | Because buckshot's what the big boys use...;^) | BTOVT::REMILLARD_K | | Fri Oct 20 1989 19:08 | 35 |
|
re .9
You must be a damn good shot. I've used steel 2's on duck and have
had good luck, but I like to drop my birds (not saying you don't)
not bleed 'em. The hunting I do for geese is stalking and pass shooting,
very little decoy work. Shots tend to be on the long side, 50 yds.
being the average. I don't know, lead 2's seem to work okay, but lead
4's on geese!!!! that's what a steel 2 equals, hey if it's working,
super...the large size is working for me. Figure it's more challenging
when you're only shooting 62 pellets...
I'd like to find a spot where I can hunt geese on a regular basis over
decoys at 40 yds or so...in VT those places are few and far between.
The geese are sure here, but so are the hunters, a flock starts using a
field and forget it, everyone's setting up the first chance. I am of
course talking about northern VT, other areas of VT the competition is
probably way down (Addison aside). I'm not the most experienced goose
hunter around, got into it about 3 years ago. I hunt with a guy who
was born and raised on a farm (still lives there), who's family has shot
probably 100's of geese, and I'm using what he has recommended. But
you know how farmers can be...large shot size and that's it...nothing
else works. These people only shoot the geese on the way out of the
fields in the afternoon, so the shots are sometimes long 50 - 60 yds,
which really isn't a problem with the right ammo.
As I shoot steel shot more I am learning that it is more effective than
I have given it credit for. I could probably go to 4's for duck and do
real well. 1's for geese sounds logical, but my gut feel was lead 2's
for geese was the smallest, so BB steel would be the smallest I would
choose.
oh well, a little logic (or illogic) on why I do what I do...
Kevin
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| 517.11 | grouse/woodcock loads I use | LESNET::JUCH | | Mon Oct 23 1989 17:44 | 60 |
| Shot sizes I use? Need to talk about the load, the gun, and the
shooter in addition to the game.
In standard shells I use skeet loads (all gauges 28-12) for the
first shot in #9 if I have open chokes (skeet, IC, cylinder) OR
dove/quail promo loads in #8. The second has soft shot and tends
to spread better than skeet loads. If you have a pump or a semi
you can load these as your chambered round. I know it's in vogue
to dump on the promo loads but they can be the right tool for the
job if open patterns are wanted. I recently went on a grouse hunt
where they had either promo loads or magnum 23/4" 20 gauge for grouse
and woodcock. I chose the promo and was glad I did. These loads
will kill a woodcock/grouse as far away as you can see it in early
season cover.
For the second shot (barrel) I like a 71/2 express load (28 g.),
a 71/2 1 oz. field load (20 g.), or 71/2 3 dram trap load (12gauge).
If I were hunting in extremely heavy cover I'd go to #6's, and I'd
leave the 28 g at home unless I were confident the reduction in
payload was made up in some other way (handling speed, gun fit,
etc.)
I am very much in favor of cylinder bore and scatter/brush/speader
loads for this type of hunting. Most grouse and woodcock are shot
under 20 yards, and many are shot under 10 yards. To do justice
to these birds, you need something that kills cleanly but does not
"spoil the game for the table" as the British say. We've all seen
woodcock hit at too short a range by too tight a pattern - there's
little left. Scatter loads are now available from Orvis, and I've
also seen ads in Wing and Shot from a company called the Cubic Shot
Company for their loads. Both work. Oh yes, Federal makes a Sporting
Clays load in 9-71/2 that is absolutely deadly stock #t122(?) on
grouse and woodcock. No shot protector but extra hard shot - spread
with smack. This used to be called Special Target, I think.
If you handload, there are all sorts of options open to you. For
scatter loads, 12 g. Pattern Control post wads (avail. from Gander Mountain
relaoding catalog) and 28/20/16(?)/28 Poly Wad (see ads in hunting
mags) Spred-R wads are avaliable. I've used all with good success
to increase pattern size and distribution with standard reloading
components. Square shot is avaliable from the Cubic Shot Company.
I don't know anyone who sells flat shot but this is what Orvis uses.
Usually the amount of improvement is greatest with tight choked
guns (full choke -> iC with spreader load) but you need to PATTERN
YOUR GUN if you really want to know what is going on. I've also
tried hybrids of 9's and 71/2s with some success.
Re: comment above about needing coarser shot when the leaves come
down. This past weekend I hunted northern Vermont "guided" by a
local dog trainer. The dogs found lots of birds. I didn't think
they were flushing farther away except in a well-know cover that
had obviously been hunted before. I used 9's and 71/2's with success
in a 28 bore. My host said he liked to use 6's in early season
to punch through the leaves. He probably has something there.
He also feels they open up more, and spoil fewer birds.....
Bill
I know that George Bird Evans is against brush loads and cylinder
bores but his Purdey I believe is bored skeet 1ish in the open barrel
and he favors
R wads
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