Conference vmsnet::hunting$note:hunting

    Well, phesant season began here in Michigan on Saturday too. I was
    out after grouse last weekend and saw 3 ringneck hens (and so did
    my lab!) but did'nt go looking for the rooster since season was
    not open then. I wanted to get out today but household chores found
    me; perhaps tomorrow. The phesant are finally coming back in Michigan
    after 3 mild winters but the "modern" environmentally un-enlightened
    farming practices of cutting all fence rows down as well as drainage
    ditches combined with herbicides have really stressed the ringnecks.
    There is an effort to introduce sechewan and its coming along well
    but "this ain't Nebraska!"

   Well, the stocking for the most part was right to what Dave Williams,
    manager of the High Ridge Management Area said it would be. It was
    confined to Bolton Flats and Hubardston, the high voting areas.
    I hunted Birch Hill Dam in Winchendon, knowing the stocking would be
    bad but being my pup is only six months I wanted a low pressure
    area. She worked great and her discipline around the other dogs and
    hunters was outstanding, which was the goal I had set for her at
    this time in her age. As far as birds, I heard ten shots all day
    and only met two guys that got one bird each. One of the local
    guys watched them stock wednesday and he said he seen them put out
    only three birds in three different fields. He said he didn't know
    if they put out birds in some of the fieds where he couldn't drive.

    My brother hunted Hubardston both himself and his partner limited
    out in only an hour. A guy I talked to this morning limited out
    at Bolton Flats. I haven't heard about Bare Falls or some of the
    other areas. How did you other guys do ?
    
    Jim

   
     Westboro was stocked Wednesday the 19th. A friend's dog put out
     one, and he watched a few walking in the roads.
     In conversations I've had/overheard with some of the EPs, they
     didn't seem to think there would be a big change in the stocking
     procedures. High Ridge has never been heavily stocked, that I've
     heard of anyway. Bolton, Hubbardston and Barre have always received
     a high number of birds because of the hunting pressure there. It
     only makes sense !! 
    
    dave

    
    
    	There were PLENTY at Barre on Friday!!! I missed three but
    got my limit thanks to EXCELLENT dog work by my springer :-)
    
    			No BB's in the skin...:-)
    
    
    				Mike

         On opening day I hunted with a good friend who mostly hunts
         waterfowl. His lifetime bag of upland birds included 1
         pheasant, 1 grouse, and 2 woodcock. A few times a year he
         drives an hour to join me for some upland bird hunting. He
         always seems to bring plenty of bad luck with him and I
         always feel a little bad about sending him home empty handed. 

         This year he brought along some good luck but kept it mostly
         to himself. Before one o'clock, he had his limit of pheasant
         and woodcock! My dog, who worked beautifully, gave him every
         shot except one--a woodcock that he bumped while we run to
         retrieve *my* crippled pheasant.

         I had only two opportunities; I recovered that crippled
         pheasant and took a crack at a rocketing grouse. Nonetheless,
         I had a terrific time directing the hunt and working the dog
         for a happy hunter whose time had finally come.
                                    
         Although I do most of my pheasant hunting at the wildlife
         management areas, it sure is nice when you can find birds on
         a farm like we did on opening day. 

         Doug

    
    	I've been bringing the dog in all week to work on his handling
    at lunch. Great excuse  :-) I've been working the Bolton Flats.
    I haven't detected any day which there have been more birds than 
    others (of course there is always today), in fact I haven't seen
    a bird since the day after the opener. I've talked to a number of
    other hunters, and they all seem to have seen/shot at some. I'd like 
    to figure out which days the F&G folks are stocking to at least
    get the dog into some birds. A couple hunters have mentioned the
    pheasant seem to be sitting in trees more this year than in the past.
    
    	Heading down to the WMA in Bifield (sp) for the day tomorrow.
    (Guy, hows that cold you felt coming on doing ????? :-) )
    Let's see, that east of 495, no shooting hens (?), I'll have to
    peek at the abstracts before tomorrow.
    
    dave (and SAM_I_AM)
    
    

     Beating the Brush at Cuttinghams...Hubardston Game Reserve..
     ...for the past three days many hours were spent behind our
    young Lab. trying to flush something.  finally last nite while 
    putting the dog in the truck this pheasant is dumb enough to
    cross the dirt road in front of me...yea..do you believe it
    no less than seven hours of severe brush/swamp/berry bushing
    and the birds practically in my laying ing the truck...
      back to the story...so i rebell the lab....get the flor. cloths,
    load the Browning....the dog is off the rope by now on the bird...
    only going the wrong direction....sam finally gets turned around
    and the bird ...cackels and oops...fly's into a tree...falls down
    between a branch....flying again... i try for a head shot, one miss,
    two miss...better go for the body with the next (i'm thinking)
    "wham" the third #7 out of the 12ga finally drops him.....
        It was a pleasant sight to see that young Lab. go for the bird.
    See, this was his first bird....and all though some may say i'm
    (this may) not be sporting.... sam and i know different .....we
    new the bird was there, i could have shot it on the ground.....but
    working the dog and realizing to have a good bird dog it needs practice.
    That's more beneficial then the bird... in the case the bird was
    a free-bee......
    
      There were only three rounds of shots heard during a three hour
    period wednesday with many cars and hunters a-field.
      Between my dad and myself we each have scored one pheasant. I
    also got a partridge last week....jumped it cutting cord wood so
    i took the old double out and scored.....thing seem quit...
    here's hopeing thing open up for other hunter...cheers...ken
    
    
      

    For what its worth, we have been out 2 days for about 2 hours each
    day.  Have seen one bird.  We were hunting Westboro.  Have been
    using the older dog, so we haven't covered as much ground as we
    would have if we were running Skeet.  Am going out again this afternoon
    so I'll "report in" tomorrow.
    
    Jeff

    RE:8
    Yo Jeff, I thought they wern't stocking Westboro this year ?
    I thought sombody mentioned this to me earlier this year.
    
    My brother's dog has gotten 9 birds so far. They shot 4. The
    other 5 the dog brought them to my brother alive. I'm going
    after work, in Fitchburg. Don't ask were, its a secret.
    
    Jim

    I'd be REAL suprised if they didn't stock Westboro considuring that
    the field headqaurters are located there.  But if you guys want
    to spread the rumor, please do.  8*)
    
    Jeff

	The morning started as most working mornings do with one
major difference, I was dressing for a hunt instead of a typical DEC
meeting!!

	My father was due to arrive at the house at about 9:00. You
see even though we hunt private covers the first week or so we kind
of like to give the other hunters time to get their fill and retire to
the coffee shop. We have a lot of confidence in our dogs, a brace of 
Britts, to find birds we have faith the other hunter's dogs will miss,
not that our dogs are the best but you would be hard pressed to convince 
us other wise.

	Any way, we entered the area and moved along the railroad tracks
leading to the main field of the area. Met a hunter on the way in, he
had a nice pheasant. At least there had been one bird in the area. We left
the train tracks and entered the field that had opened up to our right.
The field was stubble corn so we hunted the fringes. We had worked about 
half way around when Britt, my bog, my fathers is named Dude, started to
act birdy. She worked out into the field to a stand of brush surrounding
a large oak. I sent my father to one side and I took the other. Well my
sweet thing did it!! became a frozen statue right in front of my father.
He took two steps and up went the bird in a typical first day first rooster
flush. BANG! And to think I used to call him my father!! Now I ask you,
Would any self respecting father shoot the first bird of the year over
his son's dog. Well that's what this old man on the other side of the 
brush pile did. 

	One for him ZERO for me. We continued along and it wasn't long
till my sweet was doing her thing again, this time Dude came in as backup.
The dogs worked the bird down the edge of the field. We, the hunters, were
in a chess game!! who could out position who??!! The season wasn't 30
minutes old and I was on the defensive, down by a bird. We reached the end
of the field where the dogs were working. I decided from the lay of the
land the direction the dogs were working I could out positing my foe.
I made my move to the down hill side of the ravine. I looked up the hill
and saw two dog statutes!! BANG!! Why that Dirty @#$^ #$%^$%^&%& $%^&#%^&
did it again. That other person 2 me ZERO.

	Down to the next field we went. Now I will never claim my dog has
field hunting style. We trained them to free-style hunt. Casting I always
thought was best left for fishing and not the running of a dog. Our dogs
I think have the same idea. They do however take hand signals well and
respond to all our wishes. There was this one area near a small stream I
thought looked promising so I signaled Britt and in she went. She worked
the area over and came out to give me a look as if to say, WELLLLL now 
that you wasted my time, got me all muddy, I'll have to take a bath when
I get home, Are you satisfied??? NAWWWWWWWW was my reply!!! I signaled
again to a different spot and in she went! She worked the area and soon
was joined by Dude. They began to make trail and I followed. It wasn't
long and the prettiest sight fell upon my eyes. There was Dude locked 
solid with Britt two steps behind in an honor point. I think how nice it
would be to have a camera!! I move in, shhhhh don't let that other 
person know what's going on!! CaCkle CaCkle CaCkle-BANG! My dog
got to the bird first and retrieved it right to my feet. I hear
something that sounded like a bear with indigestion, I look around and
it's that other person!!  heee heee heee Him 2 me 1.

	We moved on the the last spot of the area that was worth trying.
Heavy cover, Thick high brush. The dogs did a splendid job. We
had 5 more flushes for the day with one more shot for me. None of the others
were suitable. No I didn't get the only other one I shot at. Wasn't an
easy shot. The bird was out 35 yards and going like the devil was on
his tail, had to listen to that other person all the way home. 

	We ended the day at 2:00 with three roosters two tired dogs
and that other person 2 me 1 .   
                      ^    ^
                     8#(  ;^)

	It was a good start. Their were 8 flushes in all, four shots taken,
and with 3 birds down. I don't think this will keep up but I can dream.
            

	Steve_who_might_leave_that_other_person_home.
		;^) ;^)

    "The bird went about 15lb's"  ...other guys said that they stocked
    20lb birds."
    
    
    Excuse me for asking but is this the pheasant note or the goose
    note?
    
    Jeff

    yeah, it does sound like its starting to get deep. I better leave
    the 20lb. thing in the rumor closet. The bird I got though, looked
    like a turkey taking off. In fact I got it becasue he was so slow
    in taking off. Smaller birds would have gotton away, becasue I was
    suprised when he went up, and some tree limbs blocked any chance for
    a shot for the first 30yds.
    
    No BS
    Jim

    Well just to prove a point, I just called the Westboro office 
    of the F&G office and talked to a biologist.  He stated that the
    birds that are stocked by the state are, and I quote "between 2
    and 3lbs each."  So if you think you got one that is close to 15lb's
    I would call Guiness.  This guy stated that it rare to get a goose
    over 15lbs.  FWIW dept. I shot 3 geese last Friday, 2 of which I
    thought were huge, the biggest weighed 14lb on a cheep scale.                                              
                      
    Jeff

     Is it possible to hunt pheasant effectively by yourself? I have
    no dog, and no partner yet. The last two days I've had a pleasant
    afternoon walk in a field with a gun. And that's about it. No birds
    sighted, no shots. I'm hunting a place that is relatively well hunted
    and is stocked by the state (NH). Yesterday, I had the place to
    myself. 
    
     I got so bored yesterday, that when I was walking thorugh one area
    that had some broken clay pidgeons on it, I picked one up (a whole
    one). I threw it by hand, and I thought it went far enough for me
    to shoot. Next one, I thought. I found another unbroken one, tossed
    it, and took a shot at it. Hit it! Surprise of all surprises. I
    really wanted to see if the shells were still good, I've had them
    for 8 years. They are.
    
    The Doctah
    
    (Anybody in NH with a dog need a partner for tomorrow am?)

    RE:15
    OK Jeff, I give. The weight was a guesstamit, but it proves on thing.
    Don't listen to me. I can take the ball busting though so its OK.
    
    RE:16
    If I didn't have a dog, I would not be hunting pheasants. I'd be bowhunting
    for deer instead. When you hunt with a dog you still work hard to
    get a bird, but when you hunt without one its only luck that will
    get you a bird. The biggest thrill for me in hunting pheasants is
    watching the dog work. Even when I get skunked, I still have an
    enjoyable time becasue of the dog. A dog is the best hunting companion 
    you can have. You can be the biggest dope in the woods, but your dog 
    will treat you like your its hero.
    You can lie like a SOB and they still love ya. Right Jeff ? Your best 
    bet is to work out getting a dog, (best dog is a springer spanial) 
    they only find 15lb. birds.

    Jim( who humbles himself before Jeff Amberson)
    

         Re 16,
    
         You'll never have the success that a good dog can bring, but
         there are a few simple tactics that will put you well ahead
         of most dogless hunters.

         First of all, you've got to work hard and get in the nasty
         places where the birds hide. Protect yourself with some good
         brush pants, coat, and gloves. And protect your eyes from
         snapping twigs with a pair of glasses.

         Always stop frequently and stand still for at least 10
         seconds. If there's a pheasant hiding in the area waiting for
         you to pass, he'll think you've spotted him, get nervous, and
         flush. This really works and I can recall three pheasants
         that I bagged this way before I got my dog. It works for
         woodcock and grouse too. 
                         
         Zigzag through the cover and push birds toward open ground.
         Once pheasants learn not to fly, they'll lie still and let
         you pass or they'll walk ahead of you. If you zigzag through
         the cover you can move the birds in front of you. When the
         bird reaches the edge of the cover, he'll flash rather than
         walk out into the open.

         Doug                     
               

    Jim,
      Did you ever meet my 280lb Lab?  Now this dog is great to take
    duck hunting.  We were hunting down the Cape once, off of Monomoy
    Island.  You have to appreciate the rip that occurs in this area
    right after the tide change.  Anyway, we were just coming in past the
    island when the motor quit.  We were in DEEP sh!&.  Well luckily
    we had "Ole Tug" with us.  Without hesitating a moment he was over
    the rail and had the line in his mouth, towing us towards land!
    We were doing a good 15kts just ahead of an oncoming squall line.
    Now when we reached the landing, Ole Tug didn't even slow down,
    he just kept on pulling till he had the Whaler pulled right up on
    shore.  Didn't even have to get our feet wet.  Honest.                                                
                                                  
    Jeff

    Well thats a great one Jeff, but did I ever tell you about my
    last springer ? She was so good with her nose that I would take her
    upto the Ayer pheasant farm in the spring an have her sniff the 
    pheasant eggs. The next fall she could find those same pheasants all
    growed up. 
    Or how about my brothers springer ? While  waiting
    in a duck blind for birds to come, he would have her swim the bottom
    of the pond to pick up lost fishing lures.

    Jim

    Those must have been the eggs which were the size of watermellons?
    
    Jeff

    Ya know, I've been thinking about writting for Outdoor Life Magazine.
    Maybe I can use the material in this note. What do you think ?
    
    Jim

       Alright by me, just don't use my real name.
    
    What did your dog think of his first real birds?  Bet his "excitement"
    level went up a few notches.  Never ceases to amaze me how an already
    hyped dog can get even more excited once they get a bird.  Makes
    it all worthwhile.
    
    Jeff

    Actually Jeff, when she put the bird up she was about 6 feet from
    it. She wathced it, but was unable to see me hit it because of the
    high grass and the distance that I shot it at. When we went into
    the woods to get it, she found it but didn't know what to do with
    it. I praised her and she watched me pouch it. She seemed to look
    like something good happened, but couldn't put the association that this
    is what she is here for. I don't expect things to click until she's
    at least 11 months.
    She still needs maturing, but everytime out I'm seeing improvements.
    She needs more experience for sure. Tomorrow she'll work with my
    brothers 3yr old for the first time. The biggest thing I'm trilled
    about right now is her discipline around the other dogs and hunters.
    The thing that bothers me the most right now is her hate for riding
    in the truck. When its time to leave, she heads for the bushes and
    stays there until I go get her and bring her to the truck. I then
    have to pick her up and put her in it. I've treated her to ice cream
    and lots of love, but she still hates it. Its just a matter of time.

    Jim

    May I aske a question? what happened to .12 where the 15lb bird
    began? I can't see the note and therefore am missing out on the
    root of the fun!!
    
    	I'm not sur if my 22lb Britt could retriev such a critter!!
    Guess I'll have to get a Greatdane To tag along for the retrieve.
    
    	Steve_who_got_a_22lb_turkey_this_year_but_only_a_2lb_pheasant.

    You wanna talk about the nose on a Springer?
    
    Last week I was working in the yard with my wife.  One of our springers
    was running around the yard playing and staking out his territory.
    This kid came walking down the street and when he got near our house,
    our one springer went absolutely birdie on the kid.  He was all
    over the kid and his little stub tail was just a waggin like you
    would not believe!  
    
    My wife became amused and asked the kid if he had a quail in his
    jacket.  The said, "no".
    
    Then she asked him if he had handled quail that day.
    
    "no".
    
    She asked if he had been quail hunting.
    
    "no."
    
    The dog was still frisking the kid down when my wife asked him if
    he had quail for dinner last night.
    
    "still no"
    
    I was now becoming curious myself when my wife asked him what his
    name was.
    
    He replied, "Bob White".
    
    

    Jim,
      I'll bet that after you pop a few more birds for her she'll start
    associating the truck with "go'in huntin".  You'll probably find
    her waiting in the cab!   
    
    Jeff

        
    I deleted it for fear of people using granades to hunt them with.
    Also, I didn't want Jeff to start bringing his 250lb lab. I
    F*@@*&#($edup on my guesstamit of weight, and didn't think about the
    20lb bullcrap story the guy told me about, cause I was so excited
    about getting a bird. 
    
    My forgiveness is begged for.
    Jim
    

    RE:27
    I hope so Jeff. The problem is that she used to get sick when she
    was younger. I mean she'd barf all over me and the truck.
    It started the first day I took her home. She doesn't get sick anymore, 
    and when we get to the field she is fine, so it doesn't effect her
    hunting. What see need most right now is experience. 
    
    Jim

    Well, how'd it  go for you guys this week-end ? I went to Hubarston,
    I didn't get any, but my brother got one. It seems they stocked
    thursday this week to give some extra light to the after work 
    hunters before the clocks got pushed back. I late went up to Birch-
    Hill Dam, cause I live near there, and from what the guys I met
    said, there wasn't hardly any shooting all morning. Guess they are
    phasing out the stocking there. Anyways it was another day for the
    dog to get some experinece, even though see still hates the truck.
    I told my wife a new truck might help. She didn't bite.
    
    Jim

    Freda found a crippled hen.  She caught it so I didn't have the
    opportunity to miss.  :-)  A couple of times I thought she had
    hot scent, but her reaction was nothing compared to when she was
    on the tail of this bird.
    	Linda

    re .30
    	Jim,
    	I'm glad your wife didn't bite you when you mentioned a
    	new truck.  ;^)
    		Linda

    RE:32
    Linda,
    I was hoping she would bite at the idea,(not to be taken literally),but
    not me. Where did you hunt this week-end ?
    
    Jim

    
    	We tried the Burns WMA in Bifield (Central St Bifield Exit off
    I-95) on Friday. Guy got one, I would have had one, but it was the
    wrong color for that part of the country (read, you can't shoot
    hens east of I-495). We saw two partridge and a woodcock. The dogs
    worked extremely well, didn't mind working together at all. We were
    lucky that they weren't together when they found the birds. 
    	There was a notice posted which said they stocked the WMA every 
    day with 'some' birds. They close the WMA one hour early on Friday 
    to stock for Saturday.
    	Guy followed up Friday P.M. with another pheasant locally, and
    Saturday, I managed another woodcock. The Redlabel is 80% on woodcock
    now.
    
    dave

    	My hunting partner and I were invited to two "European style"
    pheasant shoots recently.  One was 460+ birds, the other 180.  Birds
    are released, flying, from the top of a hill or a tower.  The gunners
    are positioned at the base of the hill in a semi-circle, between
    30-70 yds apart.  There are two guns (shooters) per butt (station),
    and between 8-12 stations.  After 20 or so birds are released, a
    horn sounds and you move to the next butt, so if one location is
    particularly hot, you'll see some action.
    	One nice touch is that retriever clubs are invited to bring
    their dogs to "pick up."  You always see some outstanding dog work,
    although we missed Jeff and Skeet at the last one.
    	On Saturday we had 20mph winds.  If you think this is easy
    shooting, try a cock pheasant at full tilt with a wind behind him.
     You can't lead these birds too much!  But it's a good chance to
    develop good shooting habits.  And it's exciting - on more than
    one instance, there were 3 birds dead in the air at once.  At the
    end of the day, the bag is divided anfd distributed to the guns.
     A field lunch and open bar (at shoots end) are also provided.
    
    If you're invited to one, try it!   It's an exciting time.  I own
    3 dogs, and love to hunt with them, but a shoot like this is a
    fascinating alternative.
    
    

     Personally, the european style pheasant shoots are exactly the
    type of "sport" that many people conjure up when thinking about
    hunting. They certainly are NOT hunting. European style shoots are
    basically target practice with live birds. While I admit that the
    live birds are somewhat more difficult to hit than clay pidgeons,
    it seems to be a terrible waste of life to use live birds for target
    practice.
    
     The antis will claim that the reason for the shoots is pure bloodlust.
    I don't think that you are necessarily bloodthirsty, however it
    does appear that you possess a certain disregard for the lives of
    your targets. The pheasant is such a fine animal, it seems to be
    a shame that they are exploited in this manner. I prefer hunting
    pheasant to a pheasant shoot, as you described. When I wish to shoot
    a couple boxes of shells, I'll go to the range with a case of clay
    pidgeons. 
    
     Sorry if I editorialized too much. It must have something to do
    with SOAPBOX being unreachable lately. :-)
    
    The Doctah

    Well, he outsmarted me this morning.  My Lab was acting birdy in
    a very thick bottom cover in a field.  Out the corner of my eye
    I caught some movement in the woods.  I looked again just in time
    to see a cock pheasant topping the hill a full 150 yards away!
    He had obviously pulled that trick before, but we will be ready
    next time!
    
    We did manage one woodcock, so we had a good morning.
    
    Mark,
    

    I'm peeved.
    
    I went pheasant hunting last Saturday.  I had just watched this
    guy push out a corn row with no luck.  Since he had a lab (I won't
    say what color) I figured the corn was empty.  I pushed it out with
    my springer and low and behold; a giant cockbird.  Nice easy 15-20
    yard shot.  I missed twice.  
    
    Haven't been able to get it out of my head all week.
    
    So I got up earily this morning with retribution on my mind.  I
    knew if I could just get one more of those shots.....
    
    Got my best friend up and drove to the hunting grounds.  Just as
    I got there the sky opened up with some of that famous washington
    rain.  Was that gonna stop me?  Heck no.
    
    So after willie and I slop around in the mud for a half hour I start
    wondering if I have as much common sense as the next guy for being
    out here.  But then, along the edge of a field where a guy with
    two beagles (yup beagles) had been through, the dogs stub starts
    wagging.  I knew he smelled bird by the fire in his eyes, but he
    couldn't get into the sticker bushes.  He headed down 20 yards,
    got in and came back toward the bird.  I heard a skirmish and the
    bird flew up.  Nice cock!  Pow!  Pow!  
    
    I must be shooting blanks.  Another bird flies across the might
    Snohomish River to freedom.
    
    In a very disappointed mood, I started to hunt again.  Willie moved
    into some 8' high corn.  Another skirmish!  Another nice cock!
    "Please come toward me so I get a shot"  POW!  I missed.  He flies
    right at me and POW!                        
    
    Well, here I am at work.  Mostly dried off.  Willie is in the truck
    drying off, the windows are steamy.  Told my friend I'd go fishing
    with him tomorrow morning.  Want to get back at those birds. 
    
    Three misses in a row.  Can't live with myself.  Dog is looking
    for new owner.
    
    Brett.
    

    sounds to me like you have a good excuse to buy a new shotgun that
    can hit them birds. ;-0
    
    good luck on the fishen trip
    
    carl
    

    re:  < Note 256.38 by DECWET::HELSEL "Well....isn't that special?" >

    Hey Brett,
    
    Get rid of those dove/quail loads and get some #4's. :-)
    
    Pheasant starts the 19th here in Colorado, can't wait.  It is the first
    weekend after I get back from deer hunting. :-)
    
    +- Mark (who is busy in November and trying to maintain a marriage) ;-)

Brett,
  I'll take your dog.  :-)
	Not that he would stay long with me after seeing my shooting.
		Linda

    Brett, there are a lot of pheasants that fly away without a heart,
    you'll have to follow the next one and have a post mortum performed.
    
    
    Good luck,
    Bill
    

    RE:38
    Does trap shooting ring a bell ? Better get out there and do some.
    By the way, if your not shooting a Remington that could be your
    problem. At least you got the right kind of dog.
    
    Jim

    RE:38
    
    Well, it makes me feel better to know that I'm not the only one
    having that problem this year.  My Lab go so tired of watching me
    miss the birds she found, that she got the last cock without my
    help!  She trailed it through the woods and eventually caught it
    in a blowdown.  (it's wing had been broken).  Boy, you should have
    seen the smirk on the dogs face as if to say " See Dad, like THIS!"
    
    Mark,
    

    SO FAR SO GOOD.
    
    Went out last week Thursday with a friend here at work and took
    two roosters in a half day. Then I went back last Saturday with
    my brother and a friend and limited out at two each. I am planning
    on going back to the same place this coming Saturday. We have been
    hunting one of the state parks here in Illinois. 
    
    
    Regards, Jim.
    
    

    I got my retribution this weekend.  I went out on Saturday
    and nailed the first 2 we saw.  I couldn't go this sunday
    because of all the rain......the fields are geting flooded.
    They ought to try growing rice instead of winter wheat.
    
    Guess I'll have to wait till next weekend for the water to subside.
    
    Brett.

    
    Where in Southern NH do they stock pheasants??
    
    I moved up here two years ago and started bird hunting again this
    year, haven't found anyplace good yet, but it is tuff alone, without
    a dog, still better than staying home.
    
    --Bob

    Friday is veterans day. Does anybody know if Mass will stock on
    thursday instead of friday ?
    
    Jim

    Does anyone know if Fort Devens is open to hunting this season?
     Are they stocking?  Last season it was practically impossible to
    get in there.
    
    Any suggestions about some areas to go on Saturday?  I'm comng down
    from NH...am willing to travel out to western MA.  Covers I ususally
    hunt are in the Paxton area and in the Sturbridge area.  Don't want
    a Bolton Flats goon scene.  Where is Birch Hill Dam?  Any spots
    near the Conn. River?

    Yes, they are still stocking Fort Devens. Birch Hill Dam
    is in Winchendon, but I wouldn't bother. I've been up there
    two weeks and they aren't stocking very much. They're trying
    to phase it out. If your comming down to Paxton you'd be better 
    off over at Hubarston WM, or Bare Falls.

    Jim

    re MANANA::HUSTON
    
     Whereabouts do you live in southern NH? 
    
     They stock a place in Milford on River road (I think). They also
    stock a small farm in Hudson (where I've been skunked twice). I
    guess they stock on Friday. Send me some mail, I'll tell you where
    it is. 
    
    The Doctah

    The Name of the Farm in Hudson is Neadoux's Farm. ( I am not sure
    of the spelling being french and all but it is pronounced
    NAY-does . Acent on the first. I have never been there.
    
    I have been told that sonetime Mr Neadoux convinces them to
    let him keep some birds in pens that he releases later on.
    
    He is very Friendly and like hunters. His only request is that you
    park where he wishes and don't leave any gates open.
    
    Bear 

    
    Does anyone have directions to this farm??
    
    --Bob

    ref: .45 by POBOX::UCHWAT

    Which state park in Illinois?  Also, are the birds there stocked or
    purely wild?  As always, I'm looking for the hot spot.  Last few years,
    I've taken too much skunk and not enough pheasant. 
    
    Thanks neighbor,
    Lou

    PS: I'm new to the hunting conference - knew about it for while and
    finally decided to jump in.  Hi all!

Pheasant opens tomorrow in Kansas and next saturday in Colorado.   I called
my friends in Kansas and they said that there are alot of birds this year.
Was also happy to see the newspaper say that this should be the best year
in quite some time.  Experts expect 100,000 birds to be taken opening
weekend and over a 1,000,000 for the season.  It said the southeast part
of Colorado should be a hot spot too.  Weather forcast is light snow over
night and cold tomorrow.  Those birds should be sitting in tight covies.
I can see it now, five steps into the cover and it explodes with dozens of
birds.  I'm already shaking with excitement.  Come on 6 AM.

Gordon

    RE:49 - Yes, Deven is open to hunting this year.  Last year they
    were closed for 12 days in the middle of the season for some
    of their military training.  Hopefully, they won't do that this
    year.  You can call (508)796-2155 after 6:00 p.m. to get a recording
    of what areas will be open the next day.
    
    If you can pick your hunting times, Bolton Flats isn't as bad as
    you've heard.  I wouldn't dream of going there on a Saturday, but
    I had pretty good luck there last year hunting afternoons during
    the week.  You have to work for the birds, but there are a few
    around after the army marches thru.  I did that 3 times last year
    and brought home 1 pheasant each trip.
    
    Good luck,
    Mark
    

    Thanks for the info, Mark.
    
    The last time I was there I noticed a raft of geese dropping in
    to one of the ponds around dusk.  Can you shoot them there?
    
    I know that is illegal on the river that separates their preoperty
    from Oxbow Refuge.
    
    re: Bolton.  A few years ago I heard 20 white chickens were released
    as a prank just before opening day.  Did anyone see that?  It must
    have been funny!
    
    Safe shooting,
    Bill
    

    Yes, you can hunt the ponds at Devens, but I think you would need
    a lot of luck for that.  The guy in charge there said it is rare
    for anyone to kill waterfowl there.  He was suprised that one guy
    did take a black duck there early in the season - first duck in
    a couple of years...
    
    There have been a lot of woodcock there this year.  They've had
    about 100 killed at Devens this season.  Last year the total was
    around 75.
    
    Thanks,
    Mark
    

    Great opening day here in Colorado, at least for me, got 3 birds each
    day (that's the limit)!
    
    The first area we hit was pretty sparse, saw only about 30 birds
    (cocks and hens) in all during the morning.  In the afternoon we went
    about 40 miles north to my friend's cousin's farm!  INCREDIBLE!  In
    about 2 hours time we had our limit.  If we'd been better shots, we
    would have been done in about 45 minutes. :-)  My friends cousin told
    us that a party of 10 hunters had gone through the area (several uncut
    milo fields) that morning and when they were done they had 30 birds
    down.  They estimated that they probably kicked up over 150 pheasant in
    all.
    
    I'm not used to those kind of conditions.  I found myself getting
    confused and flustered as to which bird to try for.  I ok, when only 1
    or two pop up, but we'd kick out 10 or more at a time, and in fact I
    put up three cocks at once, about 15 yards in front of me and missed
    all of them (geez!).

    We're going back in a couple of weeks for more! :-)
    
    +- Mark

    Anyone have experience hunting pheasant in Pennsylvania?  Do they
    have stocked areas equivalent to the WMA's in Mass.?  When does
    the season run?  How much for an out-of-state license?
    	Linda

< Note 256.59 by PLATA::BILLINGSLEA "Mark \ DIS/SD/PSU \ DTN:522-5317" >

	Mark,

	Congrads.
	Sounds too good for Colorado, haven't seen/heard of that type
	of bird populations in years.  I know the feeling, too many flush
	and you don't draw a feather.
	What part of the state was it?
	Do you need, or could another guy to go along in a couple of weeks?
	I love shooting those cock birds.

	Gordon

    re: .60
    
    I grew up in PA and did my first pheasant hunting there.  In my
    youth, pheasant hunting was great in PA.  We used to head up to
    the Amish country around Lancaster to hunt.  The folks there were
    very friendly and always allowed us to hunt.  Quite a setting with
    all the horse and buggies running the roads at dawn and we could
    always stop at a road side stand for some shoe-fly pie when we got
    hungry :-)
    
    I was last in this area in 1983.  I went out with some friends from
    my youth.  What a great time we had.  We all limited on pheasant
    and I got a nice rabbit.  The pheasants were old birds, not plants.
    You can tell anold pheasant because it has a nice big spur on its
    leg sort of like a dew claw on a dog.  They don't get these until
    they are (?) 3+ years old??
    
    Anyway, times have changed and people tell me the roads of progress
    are ruining pheasant hunting like everyplace else.  However, the
    Amish areas will always be best because they use the "old style"
    farming techniques where the modern farming techniques are responsible
    for the decline in pheasant population.  
    
    In thinking about it, I haven't shot a bird with a spur since 1983.
    
    Brett.

    The pheasant season is now closed on the West side of Washington.
    The Eastside will remain open until January 1.  I knew that Friday
    would be my last chance to get a bird this year.  In all fairness
    to my oldest dog, I decided I had to go out late Thanksgiving night.
    
    It was the perfect ending to a season.  Willie had flushed a hen
    early in the hunt.  I drew on her with my 12 ga. sideX and dropped
    her.  Willie chased her into the prickers and brought her back.
    After another couple hours of hunting, I decided the year was over.
    We headed back to the truck.  Whne we were just 200 yards away,
    Willie's head went up as he got a scent.  He headed over to another
    pucker brush patch.  His little stub of a tail wagged wildly.  He
    knew where the bird was but couldn't get at it.  He went over top,
    then tried to get in from underneath and from the side.  Finally
    he got in there.  I heard the mad flapping of wings and could tell
    Willie was pushing the bird down the hedgerow both from the noise
    and from watching the tops of the brush swaying madly.
    
    He must of chased the bird for thirty yards with me moving along
    with the dog from the outside.  I was in perfect postion for a shot
    at all times.  Finally, an opeing in the brush.  That giant cock
    came flapping out of there with all the fury in the world.  I swung
    on him and Pow! Pow!
    
    Well watching that bird fly over the hill and into the forest was
    certainly frustrating.  There he was, the last bird of the season.
    He left me wanting more.  I wanted to get up and hunt on Satruday,
    but I have to wait till next Spetember.  
    
    What a way to end the season, wanting more.
    
    Brett.

    I saw a miracle this morning!
    
    I went out pheasant hunting for the first time this season today.  I
    was out for maybe 20 minutes.  The dog flushes a cockbird with a tail
    so long that I thought the dog had the tail in his mouth as the
    bird propelled himself into the air.  I swung on the bird and shot him
    3 times with high brass #6 shot and still he flew away!!!!
    
    Man! what TOUGH bird.  I can't even imagine trying to chew a bird so
    tough that 3 shots won't bring him down.
    
    Maybe next time I'll find some more tender birds to shoot at.
    
    /brett

    Or site in your gun...Skeet, cans......Whichenever...
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    Just Joking..
    
    I once shot a pheasent like that in the flats on 117 in Bolton..
    
    Shot him 3 times..He finally fell..Had to run after him and break
    his neck...Boy, did he taste like shoe leather...
    
    Jim
    

    Jeez, brett, maybe he'd fall faster if you _hit_ him!! :-) :-)
    
    The Doctah

    
    
    Brett,
    
    That is a tough bird.  I know, because I shot him twice last year.
    And in Kansas.  Boy, he sure gets around.
    
    No doubt he'll die of old age in about a zillion years.
    
    Jerry

    Yeah, I hit him three times two years ago in Colorado myself...  must
    be wearing one of those Kelvar vests... ;']
    
    Lowell
    

    Alright Brett!
         
      I see you finally got a Lab, as your starting to acually see birds
    with in range. Welcome to the world of the _real_ hunters.  Now, if we 
    can only work on your SWMoS (Stevie Wonder Method of Shooting).
                                               
    Jeff (who is in duck and cover mode)

 Anybody hear if their gonna stock Ma for pheasants this year ? With
 the Duke rapping all the other funds, I wonder if the Fish & Game dept.
 will have anything left for pheasants.

 Anybody know ?
    
    Jim

    re: .71
    
    > Jeff (who is in duck and cover mode)
    
    Is that because you are pheasant hunting in Massachusetts?
    
    :-)
    
    You really kill me, Jeff.  But you're right.  I thought to myself
    that had I swung the gun at the bird like a bat, I would have had
    pheasant for dinner last night instead of crow.  The dog looks upon
    my misses very unfavorably.  
    
    We're sticking with Springers though.  We feel the low CPU power that
    comes in the standard lab is just too much of a handicap.  But for a
    great hunter like you, I'm sure you'd get birds whether you used labs
    or french poodles.  Hey, there's a thought; look at the money you'd
    save on food.
    
    /brett   

>        We're sticking with Springers though.  We feel the low CPU power that
>    comes in the standard lab is just too much of a handicap. 

    :*) :*) :*)
    
    Mark.

    Hey Brett
    
      So Fluffy finally put up a bird, where did you find it, the Seattle
    Zoo?  Rumour has it that out in the Great Northwest guys keep springers
    cause in the spring you can always shave them and use the curls
    for salmon flies.  
    
    8*)
    
    Jeff

    Yup, and people keep labs because it gets cold in the winter.
    
    /brett

    Got my revenge yesterday.  (Tuesday is pheasant day for me)
    
    I used to carry my 870 with a full choke for pheasant.  I would
    just let them get out there a ways before clobbering them.  I also used
    #5 so there weren't as many hamburger producing pellets flying.  
    Consequently, I found myself missing a lot.
    
    I was reading the 12 vs. 20 note where Amberson (amorous lab owner at
    large) was saying that he uses a Citori with modified and improved/mod
    chokes (wasn't it?) for geese.  This got me to thinking.  I've always used
    an open choke and a full choke when hunting with a double.  I decided
    to change my strategy.  I went out with a Winchester 1100 with skeet
    and mod chokes.  I figured I'd take the birds close in.  I also decided
    to use my 7-1/2 trap loads instead of high brass #5's.
    
    It worked.  Two shots, two pheasants, limit by 9:00 and back at work by
    9:30.  I like to think I took a lesson from Jeff; go with open chokes
    and fill the air with lead (or steel in some cases).  It puts food on
    the table.  
    
    Of course, I owe my success to God and the DOW for putting the pheasants
    there in the first place and to my devoted springer who pounded the
    thickets to drive those big cockbirds in front of my sights at perfect
    angles.
    
    /brett
    
    P.S.  "Up yours" in advance, Jeff.  :-) :-) :-)
    

      Where shall I start, hmmmmm?
    
    I'll be nice, anyways when it comes to pheasant I use the 20ga.
    with 9's in the first barrel and 7.5s in the second.  Chokes are
    IC and MOD.   When I use to use the 12ga, I used strictly skeet
    or trap loads.  Works for me. 
    
    Jeff (who is leaving for NY to try and shishcabob Bambi in two days)

    Jeff, it seems like 20ga. #9's are kind of light for Pheasants ?
    But, the lab probably completes the kill on the retrieve anyway.
    Seriously though, it would seem that your chancing wounding the
    bird rather than getting a clean kill. When I used a 20ga with #6
    the long shots just didn't have the mustard to get a clean kill.
    
    Jim

    Jim,
      Cute reply, Obviously your one of those springer owners whose only
    chance to see a pheasant coincides with there copy of Outdoor Life
    arriving.  I can understand why a Springer owner would think light
    loads are not enough for pheasant.  Afterall when the dog happens
    to stumble over the bird 100yds out there difficult to kill with
    a 30-30, let alone a 12ga. For what it's worth, in all the field
    trials I've gunned for, the preferred load was a factory trap load
    in 12ga.  This is used on pigeons, ducks, and pheasant. Ive seen
    clean kills out to 45yds and beyond.  The English, who are fine
    upland shots are believe that Americans are _very_ overchoked in
    there guns.  I agree with this philosophy.
    
    Jeff

    	RE: last couple
    
    	WELLLLLL I hunt with a Brit. And I don't have to use a gun
    at all. She works so close and holds so tight that when the bird
    flushes, if it can from under her front foot, I just grab it right
    out of the air, ring the neck and put it in the game bag. No pellets
    or chokes to worry about. So there......
    
    	Now if I can only get these chest feathers of mine to lay back
    down so I can see the keyboard....... ;^)
    
    	On a more serious note, I have hunted Pheasants from Nebraska
    to Mass and the gun I used most of the time was an Ithica 37 pump
    with the 26in deerslayer tube on it. I use #6 & # 7.5 shot. I can
    say I have very good luck with that combo out to 45 yards. I also
    think the American hunter for the most part is over choked and uses
    to heavy a load, for Pheasants that is.
    
    	Steve A_Brit_owner_runner

    Ditto on the "don't have to use a gun at all."
    
    I hunt with my brother's dog, a flat coated retriever. I have never
    seen a better bird dog, and have seen her catch the pheasent on
    several occasions and just hand the live bird to my brother. Thankyou!
    
    Her only problem is she loves the water, no matter what temperature.
    Once she gets her fill of wallowing she's back to the hunt. So we
    usually go right to water let her dunk her head a few times and off we
    go.
    
    I have been around dogs all my life and the problem with them is their
    owners, and thats a fact. If you've been in the field and seen some of
    the things these guys do, and let their dogs do, you know what I mean.
    
    Don

    Well, has anyone heard how the pheasant stocking in mass is going to
    be ?  Being an election year, it should be good.
    
    
    Got the dog all bird crazy on a pheasant I manage to get a hold of. The
    only problem is that the pheasant died. It didn't look to healthy when
    I got it, but for free, I can't complain. I'm getting another one this
    week-end. I used to use pigeons, but nothing works better than the
    real thing.
    
    
    How's everyone else doing, got the fever yet ?
    
    Jim
    
    P.S. lets try to keep this topic on pheasant hunting, and not "my dog's
    better than your dog note" -;)

     
    
            I was made an offer last night that I can't refuse. I have a
    friend that works in a local hospital and one of the Dr.s told him 
    to come by on the 30th of this month and he could have all of the
    pheasants that he wanted and he asked me if I wanted to go with him
    to get some. Apparently the Dr. raises them for a hobby and has about
    200 of them. It won't be no sport in getting them but should be a 
    bunch of good eating.

    Well, my lab and I are certainly getting anxious to chase those
    pretty (and tastey) birds.  Less than two weeks for the season
    opener here in NH.
    
    Mark,
    

    I got my first taste yesterday :-) Sept 15 was the opening day of
    the Shooting Preserve season. Yesterday, the monster I call Sam
    and I had a 'leftover hunt' (no birds stocked, you hunt what is
    already there). After two and a half hours, Sam had produced, and
    I luckily shot, 4 quail, 2 pheasant, and a chukkar partridge. 
    	On the first brisk morning of almost autumn, it was just 
    wonderful being out with the dog. The summer conditioning really
    paid off !!!
    
    dave
 

    Saturday was a perfect day for being out there. I hunted High Ridge
    on the Westminster side. No Pheasants were taken on the lower end of
    the headquarters building. Lots of shooting up on the Gardner and 
    Ashburnham line. In fact the slobs where in there well before sun
    up. 6:40 A.M. the shooting started. From the people I've talked with,
    who hunted Bolton and Birch hill, it seems that the hunters all over 
    don't know when sunrise is.
    
    Anyway enough of the bitching. The day was beautiful, and the dog
    worked well. You couldn't ask for a better day.
    
    Jim

    Jim, it was a nice day Saturday.  I was in the Gardner part of
    High Ridge Saturday.  We even managed to get a little hunting in!
    My partner and I got 3 cocks and a woodcock.
    
    A lot of the people did go in early, but I didn't hear much shooting
    before hours.  Frankly, I'm glad opening day is over.  Now maybe some
    of those guys can go back to sleeping late and watching football on
    the sofa and let the rest of us enjoy the sport.
    
    Mark,
    

    re-1
    Mark did you go in at the Smith St. Entrance ? How often do you
    hunt Hight Ridge  ? Do they stock it weekly ? I was considering
    Hubardston next week, but if I ain't gotta travel I won't.
    
    Thanks
    Jim

    I just started hunting it last year, when I was on parental leave :-)
    
    I think Smith st. is where I was, it is near the intersection of 101
    and 140.
    
    They stock at least once a week and I really think they stock
    twice a week.  My understanding is that it is stocked by a local
    sportsmans club and not by the state.  (I assume the state provides
    the birds, the club provides that trucks and manpower to put the
    birds out).
    
    The do not want it to become a major pheasant spot, so I don't think
    they put nearly as many birds there as in the other WMAs.  The good
    news is that my experience is the sportsmans club does a very good
    job of spreading the birds out.  Personally I like hunting there,
    even though it is a good drive for me.  Because there are fewer birds,
    there are not as much hunting pressure, though Saturdays are still
    pretty busy.  I would rather spend a little longer between birds to
    have more of the woods without other hunters.
    
    Regards,
    Mark